Are irises gone now?

[MasterAbsinthe]

Throughout the run of the comic it seems like Rick Griffin has been making irises smaller and smaller, and now it seems like he's removed them completely. The last iris we see is Mile's in september 2018:



Yes, I checked all the comics after that. Unless you include fan-made comics or the one time in april 2019 where Peanut had bulging "crazy eyes", we haven't seen a single character's eye-color in well over a year... we've never seen Marion or Louis's irises! It's a shame because I really felt that eye-color brought the characters more to life, you know? Made them more colorful, both literally AND figuratively.

To prove my point with science, here is a line-up of characters from each valentines special:



Rick Griffin's style has improved so much, it's a shame that this doesn't include eye color.

[D-Rock]

Yup, they've been reduced over time. Though if it means anything, a recent guest strip involving Marion does show eye color that Rick confirmed is canon. They're purple.

[MasterAbsinthe]

Yup, they've been reduced over time. Though if it means anything, a recent guest strip involving Marion does show eye color that Rick confirmed is canon. They're purple.

Not that it really matters, but do you have a link to Rick's confirmation? I need it for Marions wiki page.

Also, I'm not an artist, but don't you think this be much better for the comic?

[Gbr23]

I can only talk from my experience, and applying eye-color to each character in a several-panel strip can be extremely annoying, tiring and super time consuming, so I’m not surprised Rick stop doing it at all. But I do think it’s worth it, it’s a nice detail and it helps the character design.

So yeah, it’s a shame they’re gone, I get why tho

[Amazee Dayzee]

Eye-colors do really make each character come alive on the page and look really bright but there is also a chance that Rick might make a mistake with the eye colors if he forgets so I can see why it wouldn't be a top priority for the comic. Though I think it would be nice if he did bring back the eye colors for special occasions I can understand why if would be difficult.

[CunningFox]

I think Rick is aiming for a less cartoony style.

[Dogglar]

I think I'd sacrifice irises for the current art style. Maybe. Hmm okay I'll give that more thought...

[VeryAngryDeer]

I think Rick is aiming for a less cartoony style.

Huh. The humans in the comic have gotten more cartoony over time.

Looking at the difference between http://www.housepetscomic.com/comic/200 ... nd-humans/ and http://www.housepetscomic.com/comic/201 ... ion-prize/ the difference isn't quite as pronounced as I remembered... but by the time of MLAaTS 3 (http://www.housepetscomic.com/comic/201 ... owizardry/) all the humans have very rounded heads and eyes that, while not as large as the animals', are still larger and more rounded than they used to be.

This is not a bad thing - it probably helps draw them faster, and it fits the style better too - but it does seem to contradict your point.

[Amazee Dayzee]

I really didn't even notice that the style of how Rick drew humans has changed over time. I will have to keep an eye out on that more closely.

[CuriousCnidarian]

I really didn't even notice that the style of how Rick drew humans has changed over time. I will have to keep an eye out on that more closely.

Can't really fault you for that, seeing as how few and far between humans tend to show up in the comic, MLAaTS notwithstanding.

[Dissension]

Also, I'm not an artist, but don't you think this be much better for the comic?

No, I think it clashes horribly with the current style.

[VeryAngryDeer]

Also, I'm not an artist, but don't you think this be much better for the comic?

No, I think it clashes horribly with the current style.

Agreed. I was never a fan of the big irises in HP. The small irises (2013-2018) looked good though.

[MasterAbsinthe]

No, I think it clashes horribly with the current style.

I'm not an artist, but that hurt.
JK, I'll take it into future consideration.

[CunningFox]

I think Rick is aiming for a less cartoony style.

Huh. The humans in the comic have gotten more cartoony over time.

Looking at the difference between http://www.housepetscomic.com/comic/200 ... nd-humans/ and http://www.housepetscomic.com/comic/201 ... ion-prize/ the difference isn't quite as pronounced as I remembered... but by the time of MLAaTS 3 (http://www.housepetscomic.com/comic/201 ... owizardry/) all the humans have very rounded heads and eyes that, while not as large as the animals', are still larger and more rounded than they used to be.

This is not a bad thing - it probably helps draw them faster, and it fits the style better too - but it does seem to contradict your point.

Yeah, cartoony was probably a poor choice of word. I just meant that, as Diss pointed out, the big, bright irises don't really fit the current style

[Sir Chestnut]

Agreed. I was never a fan of the big irises in HP. The small irises (2013-2018) looked good though.

It seems like he was experimenting a bit or just trying to ease the audience away from them toward 2016-2018. Going back between Real Stories of the K9PD and the end of Temple Crashers 2 the prevalence of irises seems to bounce around a lot. Some characters will have them, while others won't, or one panel will and the next won't, etc. Also, I don't think Squeak and Spo ever had any.

[MasterAbsinthe]

Yeah, cartoony was probably a poor choice of word. I just meant that, as Diss pointed out, the big, bright irises don't really fit the current style

I'm warming up to it!

[Amazee Dayzee]

No offense but just looking at them in the picture after you did put them in because you like them a lot seems to make the characters look a little to unsettling to me so I have to agree with Diss.

[Dogglar]

While I agree the irises don't fit too well with the current style, I must say that Absinthe's sample does look appealing. Not really an art guy myself, so I could just be artistically inept about this stuff.

[Amazee Dayzee]

I mean it would look really nice in another art style but that is just me.

[VeryAngryDeer]

I mean it would look really nice in another art style but that is just me.

I think part of the issue is not just the size, but the black line around the iris. It just looks wrong to me.

These are from drawings I've done (the ones that are recent enough not to embarass current me, and that actually have irises - half of the characters I draw don't have irises biologically, and I don't draw them at all in line art):


Big irises work with small eyes. Real peoples' eyes have most of what you can see covered by iris and pupil. But real eyes don't take up a huge amount of the face.

Housepets characters have very big eyes. The result is not realistic (which is fine, bigger eyes can be more expressive, which can be more important in a cartoon) so having the iris and pupil realistically fill the eye just triggers uncanny valley effects.

[MasterAbsinthe]

Big irises work with small eyes. Real peoples' eyes have most of what you can see covered by iris and pupil. But real eyes don't take up a huge amount of the face.

Housepets characters have very big eyes. The result is not realistic (which is fine, bigger eyes can be more expressive, which can be more important in a cartoon) so having the iris and pupil realistically fill the eye just triggers uncanny valley effects.

Carp, you're right. Maybe I'll get used to it...

[Gbr23]

In my opinion, the actual style with 2018's eye-color style would look pretty nice, but then again, it's just my opinion

[Amazee Dayzee]

I will have to go back and look at the difference in style from now to a few years ago in 2018 because I didn't think that there was really that much of a change between the periods.

[MasterAbsinthe]

Well, here's friday's update with added eye-color, but this time I dropped the outline of the iris. I think it makes it look much more natural. Thoughts?

[VeryAngryDeer]

Well, here's friday's update with added eye-color, but this time I dropped the outline of the iris. I think it makes it look much more natural. Thoughts?]

Better, though still too large for my taste.

There's also the matter of eyeshine. Normally when I draw eyes, the white light reflection covers at least part of the iris, not just the pupil. In a real eye, both the pupil and iris are in the cornea (which forms a hump on the eye's surface.) Unless the iris or the eyeshine are small enough not to notice, only having eyeshine in the pupil makes it look like only the pupil is in the cornea (lighting and shading help emphasise the third dimension. Having lighting on the pupil but not the iris makes the pupil look raised and the iris flat.)


But that's why I draw things the way I draw them, maybe I'm wrong.

EDIT:
To reinforce just how important eyeshine is... I've been watching an episode of Criminal Minds, looking at all the reflections in peoples' eyes.

The one character so far that hasn't had light reflected in their eyes? The child-abducting unsub. Seems to me that if professional TV directors think its a super important detail, then I should consider it super important too.

[MasterAbsinthe]

There's also the matter of eyeshine. Normally when I draw eyes, the white light reflection covers at least part of the iris, not just the pupil. In a real eye, both the pupil and iris are in the cornea (which forms a hump on the eye's surface.) Unless the iris or the eyeshine are small enough not to notice, only having eyeshine in the pupil makes it look like only the pupil is in the cornea (lighting and shading help emphasise the third dimension. Having lighting on the pupil but not the iris makes the pupil look raised and the iris flat.)

That's very interesting. I will look more into this in the next updates. Do you have some image examples to show what you mean?

[VeryAngryDeer]

There's also the matter of eyeshine. Normally when I draw eyes, the white light reflection covers at least part of the iris, not just the pupil. In a real eye, both the pupil and iris are in the cornea (which forms a hump on the eye's surface.) Unless the iris or the eyeshine are small enough not to notice, only having eyeshine in the pupil makes it look like only the pupil is in the cornea (lighting and shading help emphasise the third dimension. Having lighting on the pupil but not the iris makes the pupil look raised and the iris flat.)

That's very interesting. I will look more into this in the next updates. Do you have some image examples to show what you mean?

Other than what I posted earlier?

I'm at work at the moment so I only have my phone on me. I'd suggest just watching a TV show or movie and focusing on the eyes. The eyeshine won't always overlap pupil and iris, since it may be smaller, larger, more diffuse or even absent depending on lighting conditions and direction... but having it do so at least some of the time will help make the eyes feel more like real ones, even if you'receive drawing fairly simple, cartoony ones.

There's a proverb: "eyes are the gateway to the soul". Its not wrong. How you draw eyes can make a character look like they have complex thoughts and emotions, or it can make them look dead inside. You don't want your characters to look dead inside unless it's intentional.

[MasterAbsinthe]

There's a proverb: "eyes are the gateway to the soul". Its not wrong. How you draw eyes can make a character look like they have complex thoughts and emotions, or it can make them look dead inside. You don't want your characters to look dead inside unless it's intentional.

I see, I will consider this when the next update comes around.

[biddyfox]

honestly, i know this might be an unpopular opinion, but as an artist, i feel like the old style of eyes doesn't work with rick's improved, more print-tailored art. the irises-like-dinnerplates significantly reduce the space in the eye for the irises to go, narrowing the range of expressions possible - for instance you'll notice that in some of the edits you made, the pupil is not in the center of the cornea; this is because the irises in the original, small-iris versions are at further-out parts of the eye than would be possible with the alternative. this is why the edits seem to be perhaps a little less emotional - the lack of scleral real estate reduces the perceived emotional range. another thing is that, as deer mentioned, the eyes were smaller in the old style.

[SergeiTheFox]

In my opinion, the actual style with 2018's eye-color style would look pretty nice, but then again, it's just my opinion

If the current art style were to re-incorporate irises, I very much agree that the 2018-era style iris would work best with it.

But honestly, it feels like irises in the current version of the comic would be better suited for the more detailed pages that come out like arc-endings, heavy emotional plot points, and holiday occasions rather than the standard comic page.

[Amazee Dayzee]

That is exactly what I was thinking and pointed out a few posts before you. Great minds think alike.

[ZAR22]

Don't know if this thread is dead, but on the subject of art styles, does anyone else notice how Mr. Griffin has made the females look more humanoid female anatomy? Specifically bailey and sasha? Bailey has created lines on her fur to give the optical illusion she has a certain body part when she doesn't, and sasha has puffed out fur on that area, unlike bailey, giving a somewhat similar effect. And sasha especially has the more hour glass shape, along with her fur on her head resembling actual hair rather than fur. Also, anyone notice the detail that a little while back, sasha was basically given a "MLP" styled tattoo mark of a brown heart or two? Also her muzzle is more longer, and flatter than the old one. And I don't think she has prominent eyelashes anymore. And both ears don't stick straight up anymore.

Also, while I understand and sort of agree the current art style may not fit for eye color, I think if rick went back to the art style in the heaven is not enough arc, or a artstyle similar, then we would see a better art style were the eye color really shined (IMO).

but the example Absinthe gave, I think he needs to make the eye color smaller, without black lines, and with light reflection.

There IS, however, a alternative I would like to see that may compromise between eye color and fitting with the art style:

Make the black pupil the color OF the iris with the shine. That way it's still small to fit, but not large and out of place.

Then again, sasha had that when she was hypnotised, so maybe this was a bad idea. I dunno akshsjamk

[GameCobra]

I should point out that adding them to the recent comics is creepy, but only because you grew their eye color over the black dot. x3

I liked the color of their irises myself and i liked the old versions as well, but i actually like the emotional conveyance of the eyes more, which the newer ones do a good job at.

[Amazee Dayzee]

So in that way it is give and take. Rick took away the irises but gave more emotional conveyance of the eyes.

[MasterAbsinthe]

I have definitely seen better results by shrinking the iris a bit, here is the latest wednesday update:

[ZAR22]

Eh, the color needs to be a LITTLE bit smaller. Can we see what it looks like at half the size? Also, don't forget to add the light shine.

[Champion Wallace]

Eh, the color needs to be a LITTLE bit smaller. Can we see what it looks like at half the size?

I disagree. That looks more like a minimum than twice what it should be. Besides, if you make it too small we're back to the original problem of the irises not being visible enough.

[MasterAbsinthe]

Don't know if this thread is dead, but on the subject of art styles, does anyone else notice how Mr. Griffin has made the females look more humanoid female anatomy? Specifically bailey and sasha? Bailey has created lines on her fur to give the optical illusion she has a certain body part when she doesn't, and sasha has puffed out fur on that area, unlike bailey, giving a somewhat similar effect. And sasha especially has the more hour glass shape, along with her fur on her head resembling actual hair rather than fur. Also, anyone notice the detail that a little while back, sasha was basically given a "MLP" styled tattoo mark of a brown heart or two? Also her muzzle is more longer, and flatter than the old one. And I don't think she has prominent eyelashes anymore. And both ears don't stick straight up anymore.

He definitely made Sasha sexier in the last couple of years, and I guess that's because he's reaching the end of his artistic development and settling on an artstyle so that he is focusing on perfecting stuff like anatomy. But Sasha still has prominent eyelashes and her ears seem to go from floppy to straight quite interchangeably.

Sasha had a makeover around 2012 where she got an earring, bracelets, long fur on her head, and the heart shape on her hip, and also got more of a feminine body shape. This is before and after:



He did this probably to make her feminine personality much more apparent.

[MasterAbsinthe]

Eh, the color needs to be a LITTLE bit smaller. Can we see what it looks like at half the size?

I disagree. That looks more like a minimum than twice what it should be. Besides, if you make it too small we're back to the original problem of the irises not being visible enough.

Yes I agree, in the late stages of the iris dissapearing it was basically already gone and didn't add much color to the character unless it was a very bright color.

Here it is with smaller irises and added eyeshine:



Although I think it's too small, the expressions do seem to improve. I guess in the next iris updates I will be thinking about it and eventually settle into an iris size that isn't too big but at the same time non-existent.

[ZAR22]

Don't know if this thread is dead, but on the subject of art styles, does anyone else notice how Mr. Griffin has made the females look more humanoid female anatomy? Specifically bailey and sasha? Bailey has created lines on her fur to give the optical illusion she has a certain body part when she doesn't, and sasha has puffed out fur on that area, unlike bailey, giving a somewhat similar effect. And sasha especially has the more hour glass shape, along with her fur on her head resembling actual hair rather than fur. Also, anyone notice the detail that a little while back, sasha was basically given a "MLP" styled tattoo mark of a brown heart or two? Also her muzzle is more longer, and flatter than the old one. And I don't think she has prominent eyelashes anymore. And both ears don't stick straight up anymore.

He definitely made Sasha sexier in the last couple of years, and I guess that's because he's reaching the end of his artistic development and settling on an artstyle so that he is focusing on perfecting stuff like anatomy. But Sasha still has prominent eyelashes and her ears seem to go from floppy to straight quite interchangeably.

Sasha had a makeover around 2012 where she got an earring, bracelets, long fur on her head, and the heart shape on her hip, and also got more of a feminine body shape. This is before and after:



He did this probably to make her feminine personality much more apparent.

I dunno, I believe in black and white comics her ears didn't flop, and I meant to say in her older appearances compared to now, she didn't have prominent eye lashes like she does now.

Eh, the color needs to be a LITTLE bit smaller. Can we see what it looks like at half the size?

I disagree. That looks more like a minimum than twice what it should be. Besides, if you make it too small we're back to the original problem of the irises not being visible enough.

I disagree with twice being how it should be. And going half of this would still be slightly bigger than what it is now.