2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

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2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by D-Rock »

[2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies]
Title Text: but it's the second floor-- yeah but his ears work as parachutes

Sasha may have a few incompatible worldviews with King.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Jakkal »

Gee, we can see now, why Kevin needed a break from her. Sasha is getting more and more unlikable for me. A charakter like her would tire me out.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by dr_eirik »

Yeah, I don't think Sasha can read a room. It's almost too bad King didn't try to connect with her in the pre Bailey days. It would have been out of his system
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by yugijak »

I'm kind of creeped out how much I sympathize with her right about now.

Not to that degree but I do deal with a similar issue tied to my self confidence and esteem.

It got to a point I use the worse outcome as my expectation so I can't get hurt by it. I still do to some degree but... I can't say I don't see where she's coming from. To some degree.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Welsh Halfwit »

It’s not you, sweetie, it’s him
wanting to play at ‘suicide’
because he likes you enough
that he can’t stay inside.
She made it all for her
when it’s all about him
Bailey needs to sort it
or things are looking grim.
Get down of the pot, Sash,
and go back to the bed;
things look different in day;
after you rest your head.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by fenrirblack »

A true Joel Robinson Classic. Running away.

I can honestly say I did not see this coming. Mostly because it's ludicrous but hilarious. King literally jumping out a window is so classic. I am both disappointed he wasn't mature enough to call Bailey for help and loving this.

He will never live this down. This will now be a thing that will be referred to for years to come in future conversations.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Gbr23 »

I think King thinks "what's the best worst response I could do" and does it
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Jakkal »

yugijak wrote:I'm kind of creeped out how much I sympathize with her right about now.

Not to that degree but I do deal with a similar issue tied to my self confidence and esteem.

It got to a point I use the worse outcome as my expectation so I can't get hurt by it. I still do to some degree but... I can't say I don't see where she's coming from. To some degree.
Being low on self confidence and thinking that all people don't like you, is something I can sympathize with.

But telling the wife that King is rude, and trying to talk her down. Maybe even trying to split Bayley and King in a fight, so she can have her way, I can not sympathize.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by leinglo »

Jakkal wrote:Gee, we can see now, why Kevin needed a break from her. Sasha is getting more and more unlikable for me. A charakter like her would tire me out.
She's damaged, is what she is, and she needs actual help. If she was human, she'd be staying at the Behavioral Heath Unit of the local hospital, not just dumped on the nearest convenient acquaintance. That isn't fair to Sasha or to whoever gets stuck with her.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Jakkal »

leinglo wrote:
Jakkal wrote:Gee, we can see now, why Kevin needed a break from her. Sasha is getting more and more unlikable for me. A charakter like her would tire me out.
She's damaged, is what she is, and she needs actual help. If she was human, she'd be staying at the Behavioral Heath Unit of the local hospital, not just dumped on the nearest convenient acquaintance. That isn't fair to Sasha or to whoever gets stuck with her.
she needs to work on her way of seeing things. She has a narcissistic disorder, true. One with low self esteem. All she needs is a good friend showing her out of it. King is not it. MAybe Bailey can talk some sense to her... if Sasha doesn't try to have her way with Bayley too, that is.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Champion Wallace »

At this point King's going to need more therapy than Marion.
dr_eirik wrote:Yeah, I don't think Sasha can read a room.
I hope that's the case given the only alternative I see is Sasha wants to drive a wedge between King and Bailey.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Obbl »

The Sasha we have been presented with does not have the emotional understanding to attempt to drive a wedge between King and Bailey. Pretty much, if your assumption is ever that Sasha is saying something that she does not directly believe, you are mistaken (excpeting that she is brainwashed / under mind control / actually nega-Sasha)

This also gets back to that point on negativity that we made a while back. Please give characters a charitable reading when available.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by HundKatzeMaus »

I think Sasha with all her upbeat manners and airheadness has just some issues herself.
No wonder with an owner like hers. I think it's right to think she is searching for validation.
So I guess her being open and not being bothered to make up with others is really not a dog thing.

Say Fenrir, I mean you mentioned it in a post to the last comic if I'm not mistaken, right?

Well King jumping out of the window like that is funny. But I think that was surprisingly the best answer.

Okay folks I take a guess, King is going to get help and in my opinion there are three people and my three guesses go from the least likely to the most likely.
Which are:
3) Mungo (therapy dog)
2) Kevin (He is Sasha's boyfriend)
1) Fox (Even if King doesn't know about Fox's crush on Sasha, he probably knows Fox is close to Sasha, plus...does King even know where Kevin lives?)

It could also be that King is staying somewhere else to get some free space from Sasha or just taking a long long walk to get a free head.

Edit:
I guess the next strips we will either following King or continue to see what happens between Sasha and Bailey.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by NHWestoN »

Wonder if King will overnight at Sasha's cabana? Go after him, ladies - it's past his bedtime.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by IceKitsune »

I think that people here are giving this a bit more of a darker reading than is really intended here. Yes, Sasha's former home life was not great her owner was kind of a jerk but I don't think this comic is actually trying to paint her as malicious or psychologically broken or even in the wrong here really. I think this is more of a case of King doesn't understand how pets really work than Sasha doesn't understand what is going on. I mean Sasha isn't an idiot we know she knows more about what is going on than it normally looks like she does.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by digikun »

I mean, I get some people on here don't like the idea of giving a dark interpretation to Sasha but like, it's really hard not to, especially since this sort of obsessive clinginess she's displaying is the most extreme it's been for her character.

I went back to read the older comics with her character and...well yeah Sasha comes from a potentially abusive, certainly neglectful household with an alcoholic owner. And the few instances we see her locked out or the first Christmas comic where she's getting a beer for her 'dad' are not played up for laughs.

Sasha also has this thing where she constantly dumps Bino to make out with Fido (unsuccessfully but still) which WAS played up for laughs, and later she dumps Bino to immediately go chain dating to eventually hook up with Kevin. There are very few points in Sasha's life where she doesn't have a boyfriend, which isn't hard for her because it's shown a LOT of dogs have crushes on her. Her interactions with a lot of guy dogs ends up being "who can I have most fun with".

There was a comic I thought was really telling where Bino is in traction on a hospital bed and Sasha's over him like "this is boring, I'm gonna go make out with Fido now". Again, played up for laughs but unfortunately when put in context with everything else we've seen of her, it ends up painting a picture that's not very flattering.

Which isn't to say she's out of character in this current arc. We've seen that she's generally alright being by herself before but when Sasha's owner is taken out of the equation, suddenly there's this hole that needs to be filled. Despite Kevin being there the most consistently for Sasha, her dad was the true constant she trusted would always be there, and she did love her owner despite what we saw on the surface. So now she's looking for love and intimacy wherever she can find it, which for Sasha, is cuddling and kissing other guy dogs.

Sorry for the long rant but honestly I just think this an interestingly deep arc for Sasha given what we know. I recognize I may be reading TOO deep into it looking back at past comics with current knowledge of characters it's fun for me haha.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by VeryAngryDeer »

IceKitsune wrote:I think that people here are giving this a bit more of a darker reading than is really intended here. Yes, Sasha's former home life was not great her owner was kind of a jerk but I don't think this comic is actually trying to paint her as malicious or psychologically broken or even in the wrong here really. I think this is more of a case of King doesn't understand how pets really work than Sasha doesn't understand what is going on. I mean Sasha isn't an idiot we know she knows more about what is going on than it normally looks like she does.
None of the other pets behave the way Sasha does. They do have different standards to humans, being generally less monogamous and committed, but Sasha is an extreme of that.

Whilst I do think its unfair to say that Sasha is intentionally trying to break up King and Bailey (that would make her a much more villainous character than she's ever been portrayed as), I don't agree that this is somehow all King's fault. He's been trying to explain his position, but Sasha just isn't understanding it. That has nothing to do with her intelligence, it just doesn't fit her worldview that a dog can be nice to her without getting intimate, so the most likely reason she can think of for King not wanting to get intimate is that he is, in fact, not nice.

That makes her misguided, not evil.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Ryusuta »

My "Secretly an evil, manipulative genius" hypothesis is starting to look less crazy by the second.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by JageshemashFTW »

Sasha: King was so mean to me!
Bailey: That doesn’t sound like King. Where is he?
Sasha: He jumped out of the window, screaming.
Bailey: See, that sounds like King.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by jrh150482 »

After reading these last few strips, I can say one thing with absolute certainty...

I freaking hate Sasha. I never really liked her to begin with, but now I can say I have never hated her more than I do now.

First she tries to get into a married dog's proverbial pants, and now she's invoking the "It's All About Me" trope. Hang any Freudian excuse she might have for this behavior. Not cool, Sasha.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Argent »

A *porcelain* throne of lies, in fact.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by SeanWolf »

Man, give it to Rick for making us feel bad for Sasha at one point then want to toss her out the window the next :lol:

But in all seriousness, I'm beginning to think Sasha's biggest issue is that she just doesn't know how to interact with people outside of what her "daddy" taught her (if he did at all), so to her, this is all normal. Which just makes me think that maybe the whole ECP thing isn't for her.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Vanice »

SeanWolf wrote: But in all seriousness, I'm beginning to think Sasha's biggest issue is that she just doesn't know how to interact with people outside of what her "daddy" taught her (if he did at all), so to her, this is all normal. Which just makes me think that maybe the whole ECP thing isn't for her.
This makes me wonder if they even want her to stay in ECP? If so, why? Can't she just get adopted by someone better than her previous owner? Can't Kevin's owner take her in? Does Kevin even have an owner?
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by NHWestoN »

Vanice wrote:
SeanWolf wrote: But in all seriousness, I'm beginning to think Sasha's biggest issue is that she just doesn't know how to interact with people outside of what her "daddy" taught her (if he did at all), so to her, this is all normal. Which just makes me think that maybe the whole ECP thing isn't for her.
This makes me wonder if they even want her to stay in ECP? If so, why? Can't she just get adopted by someone better than her previous owner? Can't Kevin's owner take her in? Does Kevin even have an owner?
I'm sure Kevin has an owner although I don't remember anyone being identified. If so, that person is probably acquainted with Sasha....and that's probably why she's not living with Kevin. ;)

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by FireworkFox »

Ryusuta wrote:My "Secretly an evil, manipulative genius" hypothesis is starting to look less crazy by the second.
As much as I hate to admit it, I agree with you.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Jakkal »

Obbl wrote: This also gets back to that point on negativity that we made a while back. Please give characters a charitable reading when available.
May I ask why?

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by LunarFox »

Sorry, I just had to... try and sing it!
--
Out of the window without a pause
Through King jumps, this plan has flaws.
Out of the house with lots of noise,
King, oh dear, that's one bad choice.

Whoa, oh no, where did King go?
Whoa, oh no, where did he go?
Out on the lawn, run quick, quick, quick,
Thinking all this must be a trick.

Now downstairs comes Bailey, ain't this swell,
She sees Sasha's not doing well,
On the toilet while she cries,
Trying to calm down and clear her eyes.

Whoa, oh no, where did King go?
Whoa, oh no, where did he go?
Out on the lawn, run quick, quick, quick,
Thinking all this must be a trick.

When King comes back, I know he will
Be aching and groaning with medical bills
Landed from the second floor with a whack
Doubled-over, groaning, clutching his back.

Whoa, oh, no, Sasha's going to show
Whoa, oh, no, her tears flow.
Down her face run quick, quick, quick,
King, Bailey, pray it's not a trick!
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by HundKatzeMaus »

VeryAngryDeer wrote:
IceKitsune wrote:I think that people here are giving this a bit more of a darker reading than is really intended here. Yes, Sasha's former home life was not great her owner was kind of a jerk but I don't think this comic is actually trying to paint her as malicious or psychologically broken or even in the wrong here really. I think this is more of a case of King doesn't understand how pets really work than Sasha doesn't understand what is going on. I mean Sasha isn't an idiot we know she knows more about what is going on than it normally looks like she does.
None of the other pets behave the way Sasha does. They do have different standards to humans, being generally less monogamous and committed, but Sasha is an extreme of that.

Whilst I do think its unfair to say that Sasha is intentionally trying to break up King and Bailey (that would make her a much more villainous character than she's ever been portrayed as), I don't agree that this is somehow all King's fault. He's been trying to explain his position, but Sasha just isn't understanding it. That has nothing to do with her intelligence, it just doesn't fit her worldview that a dog can be nice to her without getting intimate, so the most likely reason she can think of for King not wanting to get intimate is that he is, in fact, not nice.

That makes her misguided, not evil.
Yeah, I think Sasha just doesn't realise what she does.
Doesn't matter how much smarter than she looks she is supposed to be, she is a massive airhead and has a different perspective on things.

I'm even wondering if she was alway THAT bad with wanting to get intimidate with other dogs (I mean she was pretty vocal of it before, but that much?) or if it's (like mentioned) because she was dragged out of her normal habitat.

Maybe she is supposed to live with King and Bailey to learn how to live on her own?

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Cesco »

And Bailey woke up, too, :roll: No, Sasha... No! You need to stop talking now. :x The WC is the perfect throne for your lies, indeed... :P It doesn't sound like him, right! Bailey shouldn't believe every single word of what she's saying, and must do so, since only she can know her husband better than anyone else... Ahah, the parachute-ears! :lol: King shouldn't have injured himself, then. Poor him. ;)
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by GameCobra »

I love how Bailey is immediately questioning the logic behind Sasha's train of thought in the second panel :3

Sasha is pretty much inflating the situation, but why is the question. Still the same theory as before in that she's misreading this whole thing, but i find it odd she is saying things like "King thinks i'm ugly because he didn't kiss me".

I'm in the %98.9 here that she's definitely misreading this.
The other %1 says she's trying to sabotage their relationship so she can steal King for herself. :3
...the %00.1 thinks she's looking for an excuse to duel Bailey to the death for King.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Amazee Dayzee »

I think it is now time for Bailey to sit Sasha down and explain as much as she can King's point of view and that he doesn't think she is ugly but shows it in a different way. :lol:
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Frank »

Bailey looks different without her collar
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Douglas Collier »

Huh, I never thought Sasha would be the type to lie to make someone look bad. That’s more a Duchess thing.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by NHWestoN »

Douglas Collier wrote:Huh, I never thought Sasha would be the type to lie to make someone look bad. That’s more a Duchess thing.
With Sasha, the truth seems constantly in flux....

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by D-Rock »

Or it's simply a warped way of viewing things due to her own life experiences.
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Obbl »

Jakkal wrote:
Obbl wrote: This also gets back to that point on negativity that we made a while back. Please give characters a charitable reading when available.
May I ask why?
You may =3
The reason is two fold.
First that Rick likes to write nuanced characters, and reducing the character to a single character flaw or ignoring the charitable reading that Rick is writing for a character is always in disservice to his writing. But Rick doesn't really read the comments much anymore, so I'm less concerned about this.
Second that because Rick's characters are nuanced, they are relatable, flaws and all. Accusing Sasha of lying and manipulating when a much more charitable reading is available that fits much better with the character we have come to know creates a hostile environment for anyone who finds a reason to relate to Sasha or who even just likes Sasha as a character. Declaring that one "used to like Sasha but now hate her" (and people do make these comments) based on the worst available reading of her actions is not just irrational but also a bit of an emotional punch to someone who has come here to discuss just how bad they feel that Sasha has been psychologically conditioned to think and act in this manner. In this thread we're currently split about even on comments about Sasha that are Negative, Neutral, and Positive. That will psychologically feel like an generally negative atmosphere to most people.

And you don't actually know yet. That is the main crux of it. The arc isn't finished, you can't say you know for certain. I was literally just requesting that everyone Be Kind and give benefit of the doubt, and your response was "Why?".......... I'm afraid I really don't understand...
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by VeryAngryDeer »

Obbl wrote: First that Rick likes to write nuanced characters, and reducing the character to a single character flaw or ignoring the charitable reading that Rick is writing for a character is always in disservice to his writing. But Rick doesn't really read the comments much anymore, so I'm less concerned about this.
The thing that amuses me about this is that I gave a very charitable interpretation to Steward's actions, and it turned out I was wrong, he really had gone full-bore, no-nuance, evil.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by NHWestoN »

D-Rock wrote:Or it's simply a warped way of viewing things due to her own life experiences.
... and, to me, Rock, those experiences earn her our patience. The story's yet to be resolved.

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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by Mickey the Luxray »

Obbl wrote:The reason is two fold.
First that Rick likes to write nuanced characters, and reducing the character to a single character flaw or ignoring the charitable reading that Rick is writing for a character is always in disservice to his writing. But Rick doesn't really read the comments much anymore, so I'm less concerned about this.
Second that because Rick's characters are nuanced, they are relatable, flaws and all. Accusing Sasha of lying and manipulating when a much more charitable reading is available that fits much better with the character we have come to know creates a hostile environment for anyone who finds a reason to relate to Sasha or who even just likes Sasha as a character. Declaring that one "used to like Sasha but now hate her" (and people do make these comments) based on the worst available reading of her actions is not just irrational but also a bit of an emotional punch to someone who has come here to discuss just how bad they feel that Sasha has been psychologically conditioned to think and act in this manner. In this thread we're currently split about even on comments about Sasha that are Negative, Neutral, and Positive. That will psychologically feel like an generally negative atmosphere to most people.

And you don't actually know yet. That is the main crux of it. The arc isn't finished, you can't say you know for certain. I was literally just requesting that everyone Be Kind and give benefit of the doubt, and your response was "Why?".......... I'm afraid I really don't understand...
Though I'm not him, I feel I could offer a possible explanation for why this argument even exists in the first place.

When it comes to actions like those Sasha has made, there's two distinct and important factors that determine someone's view of them: intent and outcome. People in general, based on their experiences and morals, tend to give these two factors varying degrees of weight when it comes to analyzing such actions.

To take what's going on here as our example, the intent of the action is, given the evidence that you rightfully posited, validation: Sasha only wants King to "like" her, whatever that may mean to her. Due to King's differing values- particularly with being faithful to one's partner, however, the outcome is that King is under a lot of stress.
To some people, intent has more weight: they may surmise that Sasha hasn't shown intent to harm King, so we shouldn't blame her for not understanding that she is.
To others, outcomes are more important. Whether or not Sasha has intended to, she's still causing King considerable pains- and when such a conclusion is made, the common reaction is empathy with the victim, and thus anger at the perpetrator.

The values difference is why you're seeing these diverging opinions on Sasha, at least from my perspective.
As a matter of partiality, I fall somewhere in between: What I've seen so far is evidence of someone with deep rooted anxieties, a warped view of social interaction, and a desperate need for validation- be that romantic or otherwise. I think it's worth making the distinction that these are, in fact, important ingredients for a manipulator; thus it's perhaps too lenient to dismiss the "manipulator Sasha" theory outright. She just hasn't offered a smoking gun line that points us one way or the other yet.
Only way we'll know for sure is to wait for more strips.
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FireworkFox
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Re: 2020/02/21 - You Sit On A Throne Of Lies

Post by FireworkFox »

I agree with TUAM; I honestly want to believe Sash' is innocent, but at this point, I'm starting to feel like maybe she's taking advantage of King. Of course, even if she was, this wouldn't make her evil-just a bit like her (now former) owner.
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