2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

For old comic discussions threads! seriously what did you think
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Nobody
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Nobody »

fenrirblack wrote:
Nobody wrote:
In any case, I actually want to focus on something you just said because I think it's actually an interesting point. IS this story a mystery? I mean, yes there's the unknown element of we're not sure how it happened and who's behind it, but that's just how we as the audience are reacting because we all have our own ideas of what we want to see. But is the story REALLY a mystery? Is "whodunnit?" really the focus of this story? Because I'm actually not sure it is. The way this story is playing out, the focus seems to be built more as a character study: the focus of the story is not the plot or the unanswered questions, but the way the characters react to it. Because until just the end of the last part, where they go to see Thomas, the story put no emphasis whatsoever on the question of how it happened. And even then, their goal wasn't to figure out how it happened for the sake of knowing, but how they might undo it. And it wasn't until Thomas put the idea of Keene doing it intentionally that the characters even seemed to care about the question of who was behind it.
If that's the case, it would mean that the narrative needs are very different from what we've been focusing on all this time.
The “whodunit” is important because they need to know to change back and that in itself is a mystery. But it’s not just a mystery because other variables are in play. Marion from the beginning was collecting clues (and failing) through the internet and asking other animals. Even talking to the ferals, suspects were being collected even if it wasn’t super obvious of “let’s put their pictures on a wall and Lois herself from the beginning has pushed solving the mystery but it shifted from “Where’s Marion?” To “What happened to Marion?” It’s like a crime drama where the mystery plot is the main focus but other more personal elements are in play such as Marion adapting and going to school because he can’t put his life on hold to solve the mystery because he doesn’t know how long it’ll take. Even now it is turning into a mystery saga since that Lois is directly involved. She’s made it clear from the moment they went to the zoo, she’s determined to find answers. Her reaction is solving the mystery.
Well, yes the mystery is there, but what I mean is, IS the story an actual mystery, or is it a character study that has a mystery in it? Because it's not playing out like a mystery. I mean in the genre sense. If this is supposed to be a mystery, then it's got a lot of wasted time on things unrelated to said mystery. The difference may seem slight, but it does change what fits the story's flow and what the audience expects. See, if it is a mystery, like we've been treating it, then audience expectation drives them to probe the work for clues, which is what we're doing. On the other hand, if this is being written as a character study with a mystery in it, then us looking for clues in what's happened so far might be a waste of time, because the character study is not obliged to drop clues. Its purpose is to explore the character and if structuring the story around setting up clues doesn't provide any useful insight into the character, then it's not important. The story is allowed to hand-wave more things and it's not obliged to have the actual explanation of the mystery be something the audience was able to predict based on the evidence provided. That makes a huge difference in how the author needs to plot the story. And if we're reading the story with the wrong expectations, that can really throw you for a loop when the story completes itself.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by fenrirblack »

It's not a mystery in the traditional genre sense. The plot does have a mystery element of finding what happened, whodunit, and how to fix it. The characters themselves are being examined while they solve the mystery because that is just the plot unfolding. Lois's character is that she is playing detective and wanting to solve the mystery. She is actively searching for answers to find a way to change back or establish a base logic to the transformation and eliminating possibilities. If this is going to be a longer arc then we're in Phase 2. Phase 1 was Marion going through the motions of dealing with post-transformation such as being kicked out of the house and being found by Lois. This allowed multiple characters to be brought into the story in a engaging way. And it allowed suspects to be either taken on or off the list even if they aren't suspects yet. Then we moved to Phase 2 where Lois takes it upon herself to start looking for answers starting with Thomas and now Keene. In other words, the plot is the mystery but the mystery is not the genre. So I guess by definition you could call it a character study with a mystery element to move the plot. But I do believe as the arc continues the plot will move more into the mystery genre. Especially when we pick this up again in the future.

Seven Things in a mystery:
A strong hook- Check
Active reader involvement in piecing together information- We are technically doing that.
Red herrings- Check
Suspenseful dialogue- Check
Effective, descriptive mood and language- Webcomic so maybe
Well-structured chapters- Check
A satisfying conclusion- Not there yet
Last edited by fenrirblack on Sat Nov 16, 2019 4:58 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Robotech_Master »

LunarFox wrote:
Nobody wrote: I'm beginning to think you might be right on that. Given the way this story has been going, I'm not sure how you could wrap it up before New Years without the ending feeling rushed.
I don't think you can... you know, there are people who think that HP! is a prequel to A&H Club. I'm wondering if that's where we're going, where the whole world is going to be animals.
I know Rick doesn't like drawing humans, so maybe this is all intended to make it so that he never has to again. :)
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by fenrirblack »

DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds* DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds*
rickgriffin wrote:Well I finally figured out the rest of My Life As A Teenage Squirrel... and it just happened to end on Christmas again. Soooo... another timeskip ending!
We have 17 strips to go. Put your final bets, thoughts and theories in now. Put it all on the table.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by biddyfox »

rickgriffin wrote:Well I finally figured out the rest of My Life As A Teenage Squirrel... and it just happened to end on Christmas again. Soooo... another timeskip ending!
mister griffin have you been making this up as you go along
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

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Oh, he does that all the time :lol:
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Elwood Blutarsky »

LunarFox wrote:
Nobody wrote:you know, there are people who think that HP! is a prequel to A&H Club. I'm wondering if that's where we're going, where the whole world is going to be animals.
I think I proposed that theory but it was specifically as a joke. I don't read A&H Club but thematically it's certainly incompatible with Housepets no matter what the future developments are (A&H is very much more adult that HP would ever be). It was kind of a light spoof on the number of TFs of late but Housepets isn't really a TF comic and I can't see it going off in that direction.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

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fenrirblack wrote:DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds* DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds*
rickgriffin wrote:Well I finally figured out the rest of My Life As A Teenage Squirrel... and it just happened to end on Christmas again. Soooo... another timeskip ending!
We have 17 strips to go. Put your final bets, thoughts and theories in now. Put it all on the table.
Where did this statement happen?
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by GameCobra »

Twitter. =)
Obbl wrote:Oh, he does that all the time :lol:
Some part of me is lead to believe Rick pictures his brain with a Darth Vader voice. x3

Rick: *Writing the first arc about Marion* Marion is the new King.
Brain: *Transforms Lois* I'm altering the deal. Pray i don't alter it any further.
Rick: This deal ... *Looks around* ... is very nice and i'm ok with it :D
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by NHWestoN »

fenrirblack wrote:DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds* DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds*
rickgriffin wrote:Well I finally figured out the rest of My Life As A Teenage Squirrel... and it just happened to end on Christmas again. Soooo... another timeskip ending!
We have 17 strips to go. Put your final bets, thoughts and theories in now. Put it all on the table.
Kris Kringle saves the day....
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Sir Chestnut »

fenrirblack wrote:DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds* DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds*
rickgriffin wrote:Well I finally figured out the rest of My Life As A Teenage Squirrel... and it just happened to end on Christmas again. Soooo... another timeskip ending!
We have 17 strips to go. Put your final bets, thoughts and theories in now. Put it all on the table.

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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Amazee Dayzee »

I am going to go and refer to the Nelly song and what seems to be a running gag in the series of this all being "Just a Dream". :)
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by SeanWolf »

Amazee Dayzee wrote:I am going to go and refer to the Nelly song and what seems to be a running gag in the series of this all being "Just a Dream". :)
If this was a dream...then this WHOLE arc better be a parody of the film 'It's A Wonderful Life' :lol:
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Amazee Dayzee »

I was joking a little bit when I said that though if the whole series of arcs end and Marion and Lois are back to normal, he would have to truncate quite a few things to get it to fit with an ending around Christmas based on where things are now. I'm assuming Christmas miracle because that sounds just heartwarming enough to work. =P
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Champion Wallace »

Moving forward what is the canon for "that time of the month" for animals? Normally you'd simply go with what's said in the comic, but Marion is established to be far from an expert of non-human physiology. While the title text can lightly be considered canon if it doesn't conflict with the comic (which it doesn't if you discount Marion's "expertise"), in this case it more lampshades the question then answers it.
fenrirblack wrote:My main point is that this means that Marion and Lois are one-hit wonders. Something that has been bothering me for months is what is the long term plan here? What are they going to do with the other pets/cast, with the ECP, with school? Answer, nothing. I think one of the reasons this is going on for so long is to get it all out of the way instead of dragging it out over six years like with King. We're up to five chapters. Anyway, they set the stage for what's really important. Steward. Steward gets inspired to use the coin and Keene gets the idea to further the ECP. Marion and Lois get changed back to human and they're done. Poof. Never seen again. Credits role. We don't need a big dramatic antagonist right now if the overall goal is the further the overall threads of the comic. THey're essentially tools to further the overall plot but once they're done, they are no longer needed...
Of all people I'm surprised you're the one with this theory seeing as you are the main proponent of "THE SPHERES!". It would naturally dilute the screen time of other characters, but nothing else about keeping them along is untenable. You brought up King, but I think the comparison is more apt then you realize. These are bunched together whereas King's were spread apart, but they both have overarching plots that advance each arc and involve some other characters but are largely separate. When King's major plot with The Game ended he wasn't never seen again, he had stubby-legged husky puppies. Who knows what whacky adventures Lois and Marion could get into after this is resolved.
fenrirblack wrote:Even more importantly, what is to stop Kitsune from snapping his fingers and changing them back other than some weak logic or simply saying "he doesn't want too."
fenrirblack wrote:Kitsune is a lot of things. He'd have no reason to change them back but no reason to refuse if asked. That's the kickers there. If he says "No," he's a jerk.
I don't think it would take "some weak logic" for Kitsune not to change them back with a snap. On the contrary I think doing so would go completely against how his character has been established thus far (which can come off as jerk-ish). Kitsune will take action on matters, but always indirectly. The most poignant examples of this are in Housepets 5000 BC where he didn't magic(k) Satau back after being directly asked, but instead made it (semi-)clear that they already had the power to solve the problem themselves, and in Temple Crashers 2 where he never laid a finger on The Forgotten and didn't directly tell Res he needed to fight, but said the right words to convince him anyway. I guess the answer to your question "what is to stop Kitsune.." is he prefers other ways to get them changed back.
Nobody wrote:
Welsh Halfwit wrote:
Silly Zealot wrote:Aaaaaaaand there goes the PG rating for this comic!
Told, not shown, and in the most general way. Rating's safe. (also explains the deliberate lack of rhyme on line #4 of my post...)
Ratings are crap anyway. They were always arbitrary, but now they're been turned into a marketing tactic. The knowledge of basic human biology is not objectionable and we only deem it so here in America because of our Puritan history.
It's fascinating to see what is deemed "unsafe for the children" in different cultures. In the US it's sex, in Latin America it's violence, and in Japan it's gambling, to name a few.
fenrirblack wrote:This is just my theory about the situation, but why a squirrel? An animal that is so small and helpless that his role was limited from the start and would constantly struggle just to survive. What is a squirrel supposed to do with the ECP or the rest of the cast? He can barely use the bathroom. The gender-swap thing is another one. The fact that to this day, it has had zero plot significance or purpose tells me that Rick threw into the story knowing it would only be temporary. What is gained by having any of this going for the long-haul? What are either of them supposed to do with the rest of the cast or when the time comes for the pets to go to Egypt? What are they supposed to do with the ECP? They aren't needed there. Marion can't get a job. He will be lucky to graduate.
The ECP isn't just for flashy carnivores. Keene dreamed of equality for animals. Saying squirrels shouldn't have the same rights as humans because they're different from humans is antithetical to the ECP. Marion is mentally the same (trauma aside) so he could still do anything not physically demanding like artist or writer or programer. Additionally, with his small size what he lost in strength he gains in dexterity. He has fewer opportunities after the transformation then before, but that is more reason to be part of the ECP, not less. Besides, not all main characters need to go to Egypt. I don't see Tiger or Bino or Sasha going to Dragon's temple, but that doesn't mean they should be cut from the cast.
fenrirblack wrote:Housepets doesn't go out of its way to be overly mean to the characters despite first appearances.
Counterexample: Peanut and Fox.
fenrirblack wrote:With Kitsune there is a scheme or at least there was. With King, he couldn't change him back because he needed him to defeat Pete.
Interesting. I hadn't heard of this theory before that Kitsune puppeteered King to go against Pete.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by VeryAngryDeer »

fenrirblack wrote:DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds* DEADLINE ALERT! *alarm sounds*
rickgriffin wrote:Well I finally figured out the rest of My Life As A Teenage Squirrel... and it just happened to end on Christmas again. Soooo... another timeskip ending!
We have 17 strips to go. Put your final bets, thoughts and theories in now. Put it all on the table.
Awww. I'm really enjoying the Marion & Lois Show. I could stand to see it go on for years.
Champion Wallace wrote:
fenrirblack wrote:This is just my theory about the situation, but why a squirrel? An animal that is so small and helpless that his role was limited from the start and would constantly struggle just to survive. What is a squirrel supposed to do with the ECP or the rest of the cast? He can barely use the bathroom. The gender-swap thing is another one. The fact that to this day, it has had zero plot significance or purpose tells me that Rick threw into the story knowing it would only be temporary. What is gained by having any of this going for the long-haul? What are either of them supposed to do with the rest of the cast or when the time comes for the pets to go to Egypt? What are they supposed to do with the ECP? They aren't needed there. Marion can't get a job. He will be lucky to graduate.
The ECP isn't just for flashy carnivores. Keene dreamed of equality for animals. Saying squirrels shouldn't have the same rights as humans because they're different from humans is antithetical to the ECP. Marion is mentally the same (trauma aside) so he could still do anything not physically demanding like artist or writer or programer. Additionally, with his small size what he lost in strength he gains in dexterity. He has fewer opportunities after the transformation then before, but that is more reason to be part of the ECP, not less..
Occurrs to me that he could do well as an engineer or technician or mechanic. He'd have no issues with design work, since that doesn't depend on size at all. But him being small means he can get all sorts of places that humans can't. Sure, he can't lift power tools, but he could run cables and wiring looms into tight spaces. IRL, ferrets were once used to run cables along conduits in aircraft. Imagine what you could do with an animal that small, but which is able to understand how the machinery they are working with operates.

Imagine you need to repair a car. Humans fixing it might need to remove all sorts of components just to get at one that's deep inside. Marion could maneuver his way around and get right to the part that needs fixing. That could save the garage, and in turn the customer, a bunch of money in labour hours spent.

Squirrels are also known for causing blackouts because they can worm their way into electricity substations and get to the wiring inside. So electrician is on the table, too.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Argent »

Nobody wrote:Where did this statement happen?
The @RicksWriting twitter.

https://twitter.com/RicksWriting/status ... 8105998336
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

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Champion Wallace wrote:Who knows what wacky adventures Lois and Marion could get into after this is resolved.
I smell a sitcom!
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Sir Chestnut »

VeryAngryDeer wrote:
Imagine you need to repair a car. Humans fixing it might need to remove all sorts of components just to get at one that's deep inside. Marion could maneuver his way around and get right to the part that needs fixing. That could save the garage, and in turn the customer, a bunch of money in labour hours spent.

Squirrels are also known for causing blackouts because they can worm their way into electricity substations and get to the wiring inside. So electrician is on the table, too.
Him and Itsuki running a garage would be an interesting direction to go.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by fenrirblack »

Champion Wallace wrote:
fenrirblack wrote:With Kitsune there is a scheme or at least there was. With King, he couldn't change him back because he needed him to defeat Pete.
Interesting. I hadn't heard of this theory before that Kitsune puppeteered King to go against Pete.
Really? I thought it was obvious.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Nobody »

fenrirblack wrote:
Champion Wallace wrote:
fenrirblack wrote:With Kitsune there is a scheme or at least there was. With King, he couldn't change him back because he needed him to defeat Pete.
Interesting. I hadn't heard of this theory before that Kitsune puppeteered King to go against Pete.
Really? I thought it was obvious.
I actually think it's a bit more complicated than that. There's a line that suggests Kitsune wanted Pete and Dragon to actually learn and thereby avoid what's happened to them. I think King might have had a possible dual role - to be a catalyst for Pete's growth, or the one who brings Pete down if Pete refuses to grow up.

Also, this is totally unrelated to the discussion, but every time I say Pete and Dragon, I keep typing out Pete's Dragon instead and then having to correct myself.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by NHWestoN »

Subconscious Disney Fixation, mebbee? If you switch unexpectedly to "The Reluctant Dragon ", I'd switch to referring to "Craig and Draig" or "Kit One" and "Kit Two". ;)
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Ash Greytree »

So this current arc is going to end on Christmas day IRL with a timeskip, and according to Rick's reply to someone on the tweet that Argent linked, the timeskip is specifically to Christmas in-comic? That's going to be interesting, for sure. Going to put together a post regarding what Rick said and what my hopes and thoughts are on how that could go.

As for my predictions as to what the next strip holds in store: They either are in Keene's house talking with him straight-away, or they're right outside his door and about to knock when they hear yelling or some kind of argument inside that makes them suspicious of Keene. The direction their story could go in revolves around whether they manage to get a real honest talk with Keene or if circumstances lead to M&L not being able to trust him. I'm hoping for the former to happen, personally.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by fenrirblack »

Okay so my plan for the most part is simply getting Lois into the ECP and basically get them up to speed with the backstory of what's been happening over the last few years. King started to explain it but Marion wasn't ready. Now he is. After that I can see two paths. Path 1, go see Steward. I've been saying that for months but I'm still confident it will come to fruition. This way, any scheme Keene has planned can involve the Badger for better or worse and it might be good for Lois and Marion to at least know about the coin for their own sakes. Path 2 and forgive me for this, talk to Kitsune. Keene mentions Sabrina and magical solutions. They go talk to Tarot who takes them to Kitsune who gives them the same song and dance King got back in year 3. No one changes back but at least he is in the loop and we eliminate what I see as a very large plot hole.
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Re: 2019/11/15 - To Answer Your Question

Post by Nobody »

fenrirblack wrote:a very large plot hole.
Just a point, because this has been bugging me in the way people discuss media. Specifically, the misuse of the term "plot-hole." I'm not sure what the context you're using it is exactly, so this may not be applicable. However, a plot hole is an event or action that takes place within a plot that directly contradicts something previously established without explanation or reason. For example, if someone drops a key that is very important to the story and the story draws attention to it being dropped, but then the key is suddenly back in the guy's pocket later and the story never addresses the fact that it was dropped and instead acts as if dropping it never happened, that's a plot hole. It's a bit more complicated than that, usually, but that's the gist of it.

Now, I think you're referring to the question of Kitsune being able to fix things and them not going to him. This actually isn't a plot hole, because them not going to Kitsune is not contradicting any established continuity. In fact, it does kinda make sense that King wouldn't bring up Kitsune because he doesn't like him. Dunno why, how can you not love that nine-tailed rascal? But his motivation doesn't have to make sense from a purely rational perspective, it just has to be internally consistent with his emotional development, which it is.
That said, I would like to actually see Kitsune get mentioned, just to see how he reacts to the situation. Even if he doesn't help directly - which I'm sure he won't for a variety of reasons - I just like the character and any excuse to have him show up for a couple of pages is always fun.
That said, if the story can't properly fit him in without breaking the pace, him not being brought up doesn't hurt the narrative in any way. It's just disappointing that we miss out on a chance to have fun with the guy.
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