Housepets!

Just throwing out there, but this scenario is an option, albeit a very distant one. Perhapos in choosing to be a dog, King is a dog, and his human past is completely obliterated. Fox will never know because King will be king, and not joel, and they live on without ever realizing what occured. It would end a few U&Us loose ends, Fox and King will stay true friends, and everything turns out just perfect. A little cheesy for Housepets, but whatever. A remote possibility.

King: "by the way fox, I used to be a human."
Fox: "Really?"
King: "yep."
Fox: "k, cool"
King: "Also, I was the one who dognaped you."
Fox: "ya don't say?"
King: "Also i'm dating your sister"
Fox: "now that just takes it to far."

Kyderra wrote:King: "by the way fox, I used to be a human."
Fox: "Really?"
King: "yep."
Fox: "k, cool"
King: "Also, I was the one who dognaped you."
Fox: "ya don't say?"
King: "Also i'm dating your sister"
Fox: "now that just takes it to far."

especially considering Fox doesn't have a sister. Bailey's his cousin.

Yeah he does. King dumped Bailey for her.

again, your randomizer gave me your winking fursona avatar and it fit so well with that statement.

and I want to see Fox's sister. we need more female pets.

date ALL the fox's family!

Foxstar wrote:I have a feeling that without a overwhelming good reason to tell Fox, there's no need for King to tell Fox. Not unless King was leaving BG.

Agree on that!
Fox is friend with KING, not Joel. Even if Fox forgave Joel, there would now be a rift between them, not to mention that any chance of King meeting ever again Bailey would evaporate.
King doesn't just mean a new body: it means new life, THE second chance. Telling Fox wouldn't give King any extra benefit, while he's atoning for his sins by accepting his new condition, step by step.

Also, King leaving BG would deprive us of an immense character. No way!

I really really hope King doesn't leave! That would be devastating.
Edit: King has to tell Fox sometime, it won't be right if he doesn't. It'll probably happen anyway.

valerio wrote:

Foxstar wrote:I have a feeling that without a overwhelming good reason to tell Fox, there's no need for King to tell Fox. Not unless King was leaving BG.

Agree on that!
Fox is friend with KING, not Joel. Even if Fox forgave Joel, there would now be a rift between them, not to mention that any chance of King meeting ever again Bailey would evaporate.
King doesn't just mean a new body: it means new life, THE second chance. Telling Fox wouldn't give King any extra benefit, while he's atoning for his sins by accepting his new condition, step by step.

Also, King leaving BG would deprive us of an immense character. No way!

I disagree. What was the idea of having King's first friend as King be--DUN DUN DUN--the very dog he helped KIDNAP as Joel if Fox were never going to find out?

Besides, "Not All Dogs" pretty much proved, to my mind, that Fox would eventually forgive King (even if he had some problems coming to terms with it)--because it proved to me that his friendship with King means more to him than his animosity with Joel. And King and Bailey don't live near each other anyway (even though Rick did say she would appear three more times).

Telling Fox would absolutely give King benefit because if Fox forgave him, he would know that his friendship with Fox is built on solid ground.

Agreed, Chewy.

Also, out of the entire main cast, Fox has always been the one who stood out most as the "logical" one of the group; not too deeply run on emotions. Considering all he's been through with King, it just wouldn't be in his nature to say, "All of the awesome times we've had together in the last year or more are now invalid because I remember how you inadvertently, possibly unknowingly, almost got me killed."

Fox would (and if this happens, I'm convinced, -will-) at least give King a chance to explain his side of the story, and I have no doubt that Fox would forgive him, even if it took half an arc to do so.

King: Attention everyone! I will confess that I was formally a human named Joel, and I was magically transformed into a dog.

Joey: Can I transform into a cat?

King: No.

Lophiiformes wrote:King: Attention everyone! I will confess that I was formally a human named Joel, and I was magically transformed into a dog.

Joey: Can I transform into a cat?

King: No.

KJOokami wrote: And I far prefer, and more highly value, one close friend that I can trust with anything to a huge group of people that I get along with, but don't necessarily know on a more intimate level.

Really? That's rather endearing, in my opinion.

Though the unanswered question is whether or not King values Fox as a friend.

Xane wrote:

MilesKingford wrote: Though the unanswered question is whether or not King values Fox as a friend.

Aww I don't think there's really any question about this anymore, it was apparent back from when they hugged and made up after he yelled at everyone at the party, nevermind his mental image of himself crying when he imagined Fox saying he hated him.

That doesn't mean to say he values Fox. Humans are social animals, even when surrounded by people we do not like we crave to be accepted (or at least tolerated). Fox is the only dog King has come to tolerate, everyone else he avoids or dislikes, and (to me) Fox seems to be "friends" with King purely to fulfil his social needs. That is it. King fears being totally alone in Babylon Gardens, not loosing Fox as a friend.

I haven't seen anything to suggest that King truly values Fox, he doesn't seem to take much interest in his friend, and given the choice I am sure the only thing that would make King hesitant to become human again is Bailey, not Fox.

Added: But anyway, back on topic, I think I am a mixure of Fido and Bino.

MilesKingford wrote:That doesn't mean to say he values Fox. Humans are social animals, even when surrounded by people we do not like we crave to be accepted (or at least tolerated). Fox is the only dog King has come to tolerate, everyone else he avoids or dislikes, and (to me) Fox seems to be "friends" with King purely to fulfil his social needs. That is it. King fears being totally alone in Babylon Gardens, not loosing Fox as a friend.

I haven't seen anything to suggest that King truly values Fox, he doesn't seem to take much interest in his friend, and given the choice I am sure the only thing that would make King hesitant to become human again is Bailey, not Fox.

Well, that makes me wonder: what kind of behavior do -you- consider to be that of someone who truly values someone's company, as opposed to merely needing that company?

I mean, maybe I'm just making unfounded comparisons to myself again, but personally, I would -never- walk up to someone and just start hugging them, apologizing for a scene I'd made earlier if I didn't value them pretty dang highly as a friend. I'm also not much of a huggy person, but then again, I don't really see King as one either. That kind of emotional display isn't the kind of thing you see from someone who's just using another person as a social requirement.

And I really don't know what you mean by, "he doesn't seem to take much interest in his friend". :/ In just about every panel we've seen him in where he was physically able to be with Fox, he's been with Fox. There are a couple exceptions obviously, but he never really -does- anything by himself. That indicates that he more than likely spends most of his free time hanging out with Fox; he's not just King's "fix", so to speak, of social interaction.

As for Bailey being the only possible thing linking him to staying a dog, you're right. But you're ignoring the fact that up until he met her, he's been in the mindset that being a dog is bad, and he should be searching for a way to change back ASAP. No questions asked. And now that his attraction to Bailey has snapped him out of that mindset, that maybe being a dog -could- be better than he'd given it credit for while he was being controlled by Pete, I feel like he'll begin to appreciate Fox's friendship all the more (considering he was the first real friend King/Joel has had since he was a kid).

All in all, I think you've got the wrong idea about King. Maybe for a time he was the way you seem to think of him, but he's come a loooong way since his initial transformation.

MilesKingford, I seriously hope you are wrong. I would hate to have been hanging on this friendship for two years only to find out it was NOT as I imagined it to be.

As for Bailey, though part of me finds it cute, another part of me really wishes Rick hadn't taken the romance angle. Seriously complicates things. I don't want HER to be the reason he chooses to stay a dog, if that is his choice: it's a rather cliched solution.

I was actually fortunate enough to get the first two books of the comic for Christmas, and the story All The King's Men at the back of the book (assuming that's to be considered canon, which I see no reason to doubt that as it's written by Rick and doesn't conflict with anything laid down in the comic) pretty well confirmed all of my suspicions.

If that was meant to be taken at all seriously, then I can be at least reasonably certain that King does indeed think quite a bit of Fox, as far as friendship is concerned.

KJOokami wrote:I was actually fortunate enough to get the first two books of the comic for Christmas, and the story All The King's Men at the back of the book (assuming that's to be considered canon, which I see no reason to doubt that as it's written by Rick and doesn't conflict with anything laid down in the comic) pretty well confirmed all of my suspicions.

If that was meant to be taken at all seriously, then I can be at least reasonably certain that King does indeed think quite a bit of Fox, as far as friendship is concerned.

I was always under the impression it was cannon.

But regardless I think it's obvious that King really values fox as a friend.

KJOokami wrote:Well, that makes me wonder: what kind of behavior do -you- consider to be that of someone who truly values someone's company, as opposed to merely needing that company?

I mean, maybe I'm just making unfounded comparisons to myself again, but personally, I would -never- walk up to someone and just start hugging them, apologizing for a scene I'd made earlier if I didn't value them pretty dang highly as a friend. I'm also not much of a huggy person, but then again, I don't really see King as one either. That kind of emotional display isn't the kind of thing you see from someone who's just using another person as a social requirement.

And I really don't know what you mean by, "he doesn't seem to take much interest in his friend". :/ In just about every panel we've seen him in where he was physically able to be with Fox, he's been with Fox. There are a couple exceptions obviously, but he never really -does- anything by himself. That indicates that he more than likely spends most of his free time hanging out with Fox; he's not just King's "fix", so to speak, of social interaction.

As for Bailey being the only possible thing linking him to staying a dog, you're right. But you're ignoring the fact that up until he met her, he's been in the mindset that being a dog is bad, and he should be searching for a way to change back ASAP. No questions asked. And now that his attraction to Bailey has snapped him out of that mindset, that maybe being a dog -could- be better than he'd given it credit for while he was being controlled by Pete, I feel like he'll begin to appreciate Fox's friendship all the more (considering he was the first real friend King/Joel has had since he was a kid).

All in all, I think you've got the wrong idea about King. Maybe for a time he was the way you seem to think of him, but he's come a loooong way since his initial transformation.

Everything you have said can be explained by what I have said:
- Hugging someone is not a huge emotional expression, complete strangers hug each other if the need is great enough, and that's what King was doing. He was hugging Fox to retain him for his own social needs, that is what the hugging scene really came down to.
- Merely hanging out with someone does not make them your friend, merely being in someone elses company and chatting with them does not form strong friendships. It takes years for anything significant to come out of it since you have to get to know every aspect of their personality (likes, dislikes, sympathies, hatreds, loves, passions, talents, and so on), I have seen little of King getting to know Fox in these ways.
- Of course King what see the bright side of things eventually, that is human nature, to make the best of a bad situation.

As for what I would consider real friendship, I think you would surmise what I believe it to be from what I have said on this post. Real friendship is a lot more deeper and personal than merely having social buddies who mean nothing to you as well as you meaning nothing to them.

MilesKingford wrote: Everything you have said can be explained by what I have said:
- Hugging someone is not a huge emotional expression, complete strangers hug each other if the need is great enough, and that's what King was doing. He was hugging Fox to retain him for his own social needs, that is what the hugging scene really came down to.
- Merely hanging out with someone does not make them your friend, merely being in someone elses company and chatting with them does not form strong friendships. It takes years for anything significant to come out of it since you have to get to know every aspect of their personality (likes, dislikes, sympathies, hatreds, loves, passions, talents, and so on), I have seen little of King getting to know Fox in these ways.
- Of course King what see the bright side of things eventually, that is human nature, to make the best of a bad situation.

valid points, but if someone was your only friend for a year you'd likely form a pretty strong bond with them.

Seth wrote: valid points, but if someone was your only friend for a year you'd likely form a pretty strong bond with them.

Perhaps, but this is a matter of opinion. I am merely saying what I see in their friendship, and I personally do not believe it to be anything real, at least not yet.

MilesKingford wrote:Perhaps, but this is a matter of opinion. I am merely saying what I see in their friendship, and I personally do not believe it to be anything real, at least not yet.

Have you been able read the story All The King's Men at the back of the second HP! book yet? If not, I'd recommend giving it a read when you're able. It really solidifies all of the points I've made thus far, and if nothing else it might give you a somewhat different perspective on King and Fox's relationship.

(How) Should King Tell Fox?

No. Everyone has their own secrets, how would King benefit telling his to Fox? How I see it King just got a new chance in life as a dog, why should he drag his past with him? Basically a clean slate, I would myself at least make the best out of it.

That is of course if he wants to stay as dog. Should he go back to human then Fox should know about it while he's still King.

EvanAierkan wrote:How I see it King just got a new chance in life as a dog, why should he drag his past with him?

Because first, he doesn't see it that way (YET), and second, he deserves closure on his past. How do you know it's not haunting him every time he sees Fox? All The King's Men sure seems to suggest that it is. Until this secret is out, he could be living with the guilt of what he did to his best friend a long time ago, and their friendship will never be complete. That's no way to live. Maybe you'd have a point if this were real life, where such things oftentimes don't or may never be out in the open. But this is a story. Stories this good merit some closure.

KJOokami wrote:Have you been able read the story All The King's Men at the back of the second HP! book yet? If not, I'd recommend giving it a read when you're able. It really solidifies all of the points I've made thus far, and if nothing else it might give you a somewhat different perspective on King and Fox's relationship.

I read that story ages ago (around the time Rick announced the winner. As soon as I heard he finally picked someone I read through the winning version of the story) and it still doesn't make a real difference, at least it doesn't to me.
Until King shows us that Fox is someone who he truly does value then I will have to remain sceptical, therefore we will simply have to agree to disagree until the next King and Fox arc.

I think the truth will come out the moment King is given the final choose of becoming human again or remaining a dog. Which I see him remaining a dog however he will have to tell Fox the truth and face what many coms from it.

Now I have to revise my position. Does Fox even believe in forgiveness? What happened to him to alter who he is? Is his story similar to King's? Too many questions, and not enough answers!

EDIT: Forget that first one. The fact that continues to hang around BINO despite mauling him and disagreeing with him so much should answer that.

In all honesty...I could see King admiting that to Fox, but it could also have some serious reprocutions in the spirit world (or is it Heaven?) Besides it could potentially seriously screw up their friendship that they have had for so long at this point...then again it could be one of those things where Fox is so shocked he can't say anything or move for several hours, it's happened before...either way it stands!

The sooner the better i say Fox might feel hurt and betrade with the truth from King (aka joel). When King is still in his k-9 from then as joel the human that fox hates and mistrusts. Pete's trail isn't looking to good as of last strip post his actions could be over turned and force King back to Joel while Fox and King are doing something like just hanging out or at club outing.


A true friendship will last the rocky road what we call life

I see your logic and youare correct!

well considering that King's personality is rapidly changing since his (forced) entrance into the dog world, becoming from a cold and lonely into a mature but confused dog his reaction to having to tell Fox about him being human and kidnapping has changed from "I'm not EVER telling." to "Well, Fox might forgive me." It shows that King is braver to tell him then a few years before.

although if he told me that he used to be human, I would poke him and prod him and hug him to death for feeling sad then kidnapping him to live with me feeding him cheeseburgers until he became fat then I will make him lost the weight so his personality changed then give him to Fox.

Fox's reaction for me is typical distant then forgiving after a few days of thinking, King would have to be straight forward about the truth, no hesitation because that worsen the gap between the resulting gap between King and Fox's family (obviously Fox will tell Bailey about King's confession.) But he probably won't tell anyone else because they could really be violent to King still believing that he's a PETA member in disguise or something.

Fox will then ultimately forgive him, (The personality he has is going to force him to forgive.) and King would feel much better, alternatively King will freak out, crack then turn into one of those people who act innocent and playful but deep down is wanting to (censored by the Russian government) Fox and turn him into a sculpture or something.