Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by rickgriffin »

valerio wrote:
rickgriffin wrote:I'm not going to make too many comments on this, but it is congruent--Pete did Joel a "favor" by not only putting him on a fast track to heaven, but breaking the absolute rut that was his old life. His mood is one of those things celestials find "incidental", and his temperment was already there before Pete started prodding him.
err, will you forgive me if I point out that Pete just stated he did not convert King for the bonus points only, but *because* he needed a discontent 'follower'? I can hardly see that as 'incidental'. Prodding him adds to the already-present discontent.
Well of course he didn't actually do it TO do Joel a favor but he might as well point it ought because it's overall a mixed blessing rather than straight bad.

Again I'm sorry if some of these details are getting lost but it does happen when I have to condense a story to one month long.
I'm sure the cold hand of science will be able to overcome his magical powers
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by valerio »

i think it has been established that there is NOTHING moral about the cosmic nerds' actions. At least nothing that could be compared to the morality scale of mortal beings. They're playing a game in which their pawns are just that, with the exception of peanut for whom dragon has a crush. the only moral aspect of the game is dictated by the respect of the rules.
---
rickgriffin wrote:Well of course he didn't actually do it TO do Joel a favor but he might as well point it ought because it's overall a mixed blessing rather than straight bad.
Again I'm sorry if some of these details are getting lost but it does happen when I have to condense a story to one month long.
No prob. I'm getting the knack of it now, and it is becoming actually sort of interesting.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Sinder »

driven by corgi angst and his insatiable lust for gryphon blood
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by valerio »

Sinder wrote:driven by corgi angst and his insatiable lust for gryphon blood
this sounds SO epic :lol:
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Sinder »

also, "fast track to heaven" is a heck of a way of saying "your lifespan has been reduced to a quarter of its former expectancy"
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by PhoenixAsper »

Sinder wrote:also, "fast track to heaven" is a heck of a way of saying "your lifespan has been reduced to a quarter of its former expectancy"
<snrk> :roll: Seconded, there.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by GameCobra »

rickgriffin wrote:"Dark Paladin" is in the same sense of the FFIV Dark Knight class that Cecil is. It doesn't mean he's necessarily a harbringer of EVIL powers, just "dark" ones.
My inner nerdism for that game forced me to correct that for you. sorrrrryyyyy :(

Also, at least he gets Bailey.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by valerio »

rickgriffin wrote:"Dark Paladin" is in the same sense of the FFIV Dark Knight class that Ceicil is. It doesn't mean he's necessarily a harbringer of EVIL powers, just "dark" ones.
err, how could 'dark' *not* to be associated with 'evil' when talking about magic?
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by rickgriffin »

Sinder wrote:also, "fast track to heaven" is a heck of a way of saying "your lifespan has been reduced to a quarter of its former expectancy"
Hush!
valerio wrote:
rickgriffin wrote:"Dark Paladin" is in the same sense of the FFIV Dark Knight class that Ceicil is. It doesn't mean he's necessarily a harbringer of EVIL powers, just "dark" ones.
err, how could 'dark' *not* to be associated with 'evil' when talking about magic?
Because dark is just a metaphor for evil. It's also a metaphor for sadness, isolation and loneliness, none of which are inherently evil.
I'm sure the cold hand of science will be able to overcome his magical powers
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by PhoenixAsper »

They do all suck, though.

Seriously, nothing is going to happen to kill King. :P
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by angelusbr »

rickgriffin wrote:
valerio wrote:
rickgriffin wrote:I'm not going to make too many comments on this, but it is congruent--Pete did Joel a "favor" by not only putting him on a fast track to heaven, but breaking the absolute rut that was his old life. His mood is one of those things celestials find "incidental", and his temperment was already there before Pete started prodding him.
err, will you forgive me if I point out that Pete just stated he did not convert King for the bonus points only, but *because* he needed a discontent 'follower'? I can hardly see that as 'incidental'. Prodding him adds to the already-present discontent.
Well of course he didn't actually do it TO do Joel a favor but he might as well point it ought because it's overall a mixed blessing rather than straight bad.

Again I'm sorry if some of these details are getting lost but it does happen when I have to condense a story to one month long.
I have a question: why it must be condensed to be one month long? Doing so can harm the story by cutting some details, or am I wrong?
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by PhoenixAsper »

Maybe it's because he said he didn't want to burn himself out by doing one long arc after another. Besides, I think he's inclined to answer questions about what he left out to a reasonable degree.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Sleet »

Probably 'cause he doesn't want to go away from the softer stuff for too long.
valerio wrote:
rickgriffin wrote:"Dark Paladin" is in the same sense of the FFIV Dark Knight class that Ceicil is. It doesn't mean he's necessarily a harbringer of EVIL powers, just "dark" ones.
err, how could 'dark' *not* to be associated with 'evil' when talking about magic?
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by GameCobra »

valerio wrote:err, how could 'dark' *not* to be associated with 'evil' when talking about magic?
I know it's already been mentioned, but i wanted to elaborate a little more as well: If a evil king granted you the power of the Dark side and you chose to fight for the greater good with it, does that make you evil? People would just look at you as a monster everytime they see you considering that the evil king gave it to you, but that don't make you evil either.

Now it would be different if it required pain and suffering since those are requirements, which most dark powers have, but it's not always a case. it could be a position with greater power for example.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by DismayWolf »

So far, my favorite line in this arc is "Let it be noted the defendants nerdiness will not be used against him!" xD
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by CaptainPea »

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Also I like Pete's puppeteering gesture when he says "no strings"
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Liam »

Huh, it all comes together.

I wonder how it will conclude.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by rickgriffin »

Well I'll tell you what, I am ready to get back to regular ol' funny animal antics
I'm sure the cold hand of science will be able to overcome his magical powers
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by JeffCvt »

I don't blame you there.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by angelusbr »

rickgriffin wrote:Well I'll tell you what, I am ready to get back to regular ol' funny animal antics
Does this mean:
1)the arc is going to be over soon
2)the arc is already over
3)It'll end in a complete anti-climatic way.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Dissension »

rickgriffin wrote:Well I'll tell you what, I am ready to get back to regular ol' funny animal antics
You scoundrel.
JeffCvt wrote:I don't blame you there.
Why not? He holds culpability for his decisions; that Rick is mentally competent, in spite of extreme dorkiness, cannot be in doubt.
angelusbr wrote:Does this mean:
1)the arc is going to be over soon
2)the arc is already over
3)It'll end in a complete anti-climatic way.
Yes.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by IceKitsune »

angelusbr wrote:
rickgriffin wrote:Well I'll tell you what, I am ready to get back to regular ol' funny animal antics
Does this mean:
1)the arc is going to be over soon
2)the arc is already over
3)It'll end in a complete anti-climatic way.
It has two strips left so yeah it is.
Not exactly but it basically is
That's up to Rick. I hope it at least ends with Pete picking an Avatar (or at least him not needing to) so we can move forward and the arc won't be a nothing but info dumps.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Liam »

rickgriffin wrote:Well I'll tell you what, I am ready to get back to regular ol' funny animal antics
Was that a general announcement or in direct reply to me?

In the latter case, I meant that straightforward. This strip sheds new light on the previous goings-on and makes me curious how the arc ends, where it all leads to. Especially how it relates to King's further story.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by PhoenixAsper »

Speaking of which:
rickgriffin wrote:Well I'll tell you what, I am ready to get back to regular ol' funny animal antics
So...
Back in March, rickgriffin wrote:This arc isn't, by itself, over; it will have a direct sequel around the end of May. Until then I have other things to do.
That wasn't true? :shock:

<is anxious that the fanbase bruised Rick>
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by rickgriffin »

PhoenixAsper wrote:
Back in March, rickgriffin wrote:This arc isn't, by itself, over; it will have a direct sequel around the end of May. Until then I have other things to do.
That wasn't true? :shock:

<is anxious that the fanbase bruised Rick>
Well I'm pretty sure that furthering this part of this story further's King's story; it did depend on how I ended up writing it though. As it is, it still gets a tie-in at least.

The thing is just that I feel like I can't satisfy people right now, so I feel like no matter how this ends it's going to be inadequate, so I'm just going forward with what I have written then figuring out what to do about it later.

(Then again I feel this of about 50% of my story arcs and yet people still like it, so it's probably nothing. But that's also why I try to keep arcs short)
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by PhoenixAsper »

But this ain't a direct sequel. What did you mean?
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by rickgriffin »

PhoenixAsper wrote:But this ain't a direct sequel. What did you mean?
I mean it's a direct sequel in that it continues King's story. You remember that I was getting complaints about that story arc for not furthering King's story?
I'm sure the cold hand of science will be able to overcome his magical powers
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by angelusbr »

Honestly, I'm liking this arc so far. I like darker plots.
But I understand why some aren't enjoying it. But, honestly. I would like the comic to keep a darker tone. But, again, that's nothing but my personal taste for stories.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by PhoenixAsper »

Alright, alright. :oops: Do as you please. I'm just confused and disappointed.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Dissension »

A lot of people were confused and disappointed by the most recent comics, if the number of negative comments is a reliable indicator of such. Given that many of those were from a handful of individuals, some of whom suggested dropping the Cosmic Nerds altogether would be the best resolution, I cannot say how representative that is of the entire fan community. Imagine, though, as I've asked in previous comments, the impact all that negativity must have on Rick.

I, for one, found this arc very interesting and exciting. It was definitely fun! That others did not share my enthusiasm for the story is disappointing.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Karl »

rickgriffin wrote:The thing is just that I feel like I can't satisfy people right now, so I feel like no matter how this ends it's going to be inadequate, so I'm just going forward with what I have written then figuring out what to do about it later.
I personally like this arc. I learned something more about Superbeings and their motives. Also it brings me closer to the rules of their game, which I find it funnier.

But the reason why some people seemed to be unhappy is because there is a think border between the actual plot in Babylon Gardens and The Game of Superbeings. After what people read, they think that all of the pet's actions were because Superbeings wanted so, which actually is not true. In my opinion, whatever Superbeings are up to, they actually don't have 100% influence on what is happening. It's more like they were gently giving a choice, while it's up to pet to choose the right decision. At least that's what I think.

But no matter, it's just a silly add to the overall plot and it has nothing to do with actual events in Babylon Gardens. Like Dissension said, it's just a funny comic about cute, bipedal animals and we should look upon it with a pinch of salt.

Mr. Griffin, I know you're doing your best to put as much effort into your work as you can, but no matter what you'll do, there will be always someone who will be dissatisfied. That's how we humans are, we have our linking and disliking. But no matter that, I personally think you should do on with what is right to you. I admire you for listening to us fans, but it's your story and your decisions. And if you say that everything will be fine, I trust you in that, because you've already proven that many times.

And I hope that you plan to serve us more surprises like that in this arc in future.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by rickgriffin »

I know that distance from the action plays roles in the story, especially given that several arcs I've written have been much better received after-the-fact. I'm not saying I'm gonna stop, I'm just saying I'm feeling demotivated at the moment.
I'm sure the cold hand of science will be able to overcome his magical powers
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by PhoenixAsper »

Dissension wrote:A lot of people were confused and disappointed by the most recent comics, if the number of negative comments is a reliable indicator of such. Given that many of those were from a handful of individuals, some of whom suggested dropping the Cosmic Nerds altogether would be the best resolution, I cannot say how representative that is of the entire fan community. Imagine, though, as I've asked in previous comments, the impact all that negativity must have on Rick.

I, for one, found this arc very interesting and exciting. It was definitely fun! That others did not share my enthusiasm for the story is disappointing.
Wha......?

Oh, nonononononononononononononono, I meant in another way. When Rick said "direct sequel", I thought he meant something different. I misunderstood, apparently.

Look, I DO think this story is interesting. :) Disturbing, yes, but definitely interesting.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by GameCobra »

rickgriffin wrote:I know that distance from the action plays roles in the story, especially given that several arcs I've written have been much better received after-the-fact. I'm not saying I'm gonna stop, I'm just saying I'm feeling demotivated at the moment.
For future reference: I love the dorkiness. I never really grew up knowing a true D&D system since most of my knowledge of RPGs was based on Nintendo and i like seeing characters in a comic talk about it in a comic setting. It's new. After getting to know about it in the form of story-telling, it's very amusing when a comic about housepets has fits of RPG and D&D mixed into it. Comics have been known to do it and it's never a problem in my opinion for artists to do it, so why should we stop them?
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by valerio »

rickgriffin wrote:I know that distance from the action plays roles in the story, especially given that several arcs I've written have been much better received after-the-fact. I'm not saying I'm gonna stop, I'm just saying I'm feeling demotivated at the moment.
I'm really sorry you feel that way, Rick, You just stumbled in an idea that was, perhaps, too much original to understand outright. Heh, last time I ever played D&D it was so much ago that half the references quoted in the comic didn't even exist.
A friendly suggestion: make the jargon more comprehensible, next time. After all, Stephen Hawking could make physics accessible to noninitiates, RPG shouldn't be harder.
The advantage of this arc is that it showed - I think - how much *alien* are the nerds. They are, simply, beyond any mortal moral -which in a way makes them even the more terrifying, but not less interesting.
Sorry for the previous outburst, but you should know that we always appreciate your efforts for this comic. If we should ever think 'that's just a comic', man, THEN you'd have a big flop at hand :lol:
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by Liam »

Dissension wrote:A lot of people were confused and disappointed by the most recent comics, if the number of negative comments is a reliable indicator of such.
To be frank, I feel bad for playing my part in cutting this arc short now that things begin to clear up...
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by IceKitsune »

I feel like I need to explain myself a bit here. I love the Cosmic Nerds Storyline,I really do, the only thing I hate about it is The Nerds themselves. Personally to me they are unlikeable selfish brats. Some people do enjoy them and that's fine, but I never did and at this point very likely never will. I never meant to suggest to Rick that he should do something or change something just to please the fans (and I'm sorry if I came off that way), even if I dislike what hes doing I want him to write the story he wants to tell.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by PhoenixAsper »

rickgriffin wrote:I'm just saying I'm feeling demotivated at the moment.
:shock: .......................... :( .

Rick, we all love the comic. None of us would be still be here if this particular arc upset us THAT much. But please remember: You know how this will turn out, you have all the information of where this will go, or at least a basic framework. We can only comment on what WE have to go on.

If some of us are concerned (Yes, Foxstar, I am and have been more concerned than is healthy), it's either because we don't know if future events are going to have a permanent negative impact on the characters or story. We DO NOT know. Until this is all done, none of us will have the benefit of hindsight and go "oh, yeah, that was actually a GOOD thing, it all worked out".

Some of us out there (I'm not one of them) may have seen other comics develop Cerebus Syndrome and turn into something they were not to begin with. Some of us may be frightened or confused by what we see. But NONE of us want to be responsible for demotivating, upsetting, or depressing you, or worse. I certainly don't.
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by KJOokami »

Awww ****, man. I feel warm fuzzies poppin' all up in this joint.

On-topic: I think I've already said it (or at least alluded to it), but I really like this arc. Between learning the motives behind Pete's actions from way-back-when to small stuff like the D&D jargon (which I now understand a good bit better now that I've been involved in a tabletop game or two) throughout, I'm a pretty happy camper. :3
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Re: Arc #55: The Trial in Heaven

Post by ChewyChewy »

The thing is, all art is communication. The problem is when there is a communications breakdown--if the one communicating (the artist) and the one being communicated to (the audience) don't agree on a common language, then there can be antagonism between the two. On the one hand, the audience had certain expectations given the advertising of the art, which failed to meet those particular expectations, and so the audience feels betrayed, misled, even lied to--and so they feel antagonism toward the artist. On the other hand, the artist had certain intentions which the audience didn't appreciate, and so the artist feels unappreciated, unable to live up to the audience's expectations, helpless and at the mercy of people who don't know and don't appreciate how much time and effort goes into their work and don't cushion their criticism with honest compliments--and so they feel resentful of the audience.

It helps when both try to meet each other halfway: the artist by giving a clear idea of the intention of the comic (without resorting to spoilers, of course), and the audience by trying to make sure they know what "language" the art is in. Like if you want to say someone is "a great woman", DON'T say "una mujer grande".

You know what I mean?
"Yeah."
Huh?
"Yeah."
Huh?
"Yeah."
Huh?
"Yeah."
Huh?
"Yeah."
Huh?
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